Consumables

Gas News Forum: OLD GAS FORUM: Plant,tools and Equipment: Consumables
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By howard mansell (Hmansell) on Sunday, April 18, 2004 - 02:42 pm: Edit Post

Is there any substance (proprietary or otherwise) which will soften or dissolve jointing compound that has baked hard and solid with age. The force I have had to exert is threatening the whole joint.

Thank you for any assistance


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Gradwell (Editor) on Sunday, April 18, 2004 - 03:05 pm: Edit Post

They dont bake em like they used to. The good old days of putty and paint when sanitary fitments stayed the distance (uninterrupted by human vanity) unless broken by someone.

The joint in question may have boss white and string on. Assuming (naively) that the piece of pipe and joint is free from content, combustible substances and flammable surfaces nearby, we usually warm them up with a blow lamp.

That said my nephew was trying to change some old but perfectly sound taps recently at a school because the little angels (juniors) were blocking the plug hole and overflows with tissue and flooding the place. The idea was to fit non-concussive taps but the old buggers would not move.

I got an email and replied suggesting box spanners which did the trick though he cracked one basin. Anyway he first tried WD40 and it seemed to have an effect on the putty and paint. Seemed to I emphasise. Never tried it myself as I am seriously allergic to WD40.

Another tricky one for plumbers (only) is plastic backnuts which prefer not to move and quickly lose their hexagonal shape. Heat an old screwdriver and melt the plastic. They soon shift then.

You did not say what the joint is.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris (Chris) on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 03:05 am: Edit Post

Paint stripper (or straight methylene chloride)will attack oil based compounds quite well, though if you have boss white on a thread I think it has to be heat because nothing will penetrate well enough.
Methylene chloride dissolves your brains, is a carcinogen, etc.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By howard mansell (Hmansell) on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 10:48 pm: Edit Post

Thank you for the suggestions. The absence of a one/two word answer seems to confirm that there is no off-the-shelf stuff. Someone did mention chewing-gum remover, in aerosol form.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris (Chris) on Thursday, April 22, 2004 - 08:30 am: Edit Post

That's tetra hydro furan. Maybe if you called it tetrahydrofuran?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Wednesday, June 23, 2004 - 10:12 am: Edit Post

Could this be the end of solder as we know it??
Have a look at this product from the US.
www.justforcopper.com


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Glazier (Agile) on Wednesday, June 23, 2004 - 02:25 pm: Edit Post

Be careful!

This site sayd its suitable for use on gas supplies.

They can say this without any fear of a prosecution! We cannot use it because its not an approved product and we would get prosecuted!

I would question what will happen to it if its overheated ???

Tony Glazier


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan Edgecock (Alane) on Wednesday, June 23, 2004 - 03:45 pm: Edit Post

I have emailed the above company to see if a sample of just for copper can be sent.

I'll keep posted if it arrives and what it is like.

Depending on size of sample would be willing to pass it on.

Problem I can see in this country if this is a 'plastic or epoxy' ( ie non conducting) type product could be earth continuity at joints.

Alan


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Wednesday, June 23, 2004 - 04:40 pm: Edit Post

Alan.
I sent an email to them yesterday and I'm still awaiting their reply.
You have made some very good points in your above post. Also the point Tony made about the overheat, 120*c is not very high!
As always I was wanting to try it for myself.
I also tried to get some input from the guys in the US, on another site, but as of yet, i've had no feedback.
Thanks
Jimmy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Wednesday, June 23, 2004 - 05:18 pm: Edit Post

Talking of fitting etc. Has anyone ever used 'Oyster' pipe fittings? I found the pliers this afternoon in my desk drawer. It's a very good concept, but I think the fittings were expensive, so as a Scotsman it was put in the bottom drawer.
Thanks again.
Jimmy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By bernie beaumont (Bernie) on Wednesday, June 23, 2004 - 08:53 pm: Edit Post

The just for copper stuff looks similar to the glue you use on stainless steel. The problem is (with SS)the glue strength reduces with temperature increase. So cold water is fine, but hot presurized is a different matter.

Oyster? I too have the pliers on a shelf. As far as I could see it was a good idea, but as it cost more than compresion I voted with .


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Thursday, June 24, 2004 - 08:23 am: Edit Post

A further thought on the Oyster fittings, if they supplied 15mm in CP, it could be used along with 15mm CP pipe, to extend radiator valves (the 15mm valve with nuts and olives) and TRV's.

It's easy to see it's Summer? and you have a wee while to think!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Tuesday, September 28, 2004 - 08:20 am: Edit Post

Now their selling Oyster fitting in B&Q!! still not cheap.
Has anyone used them?
Regards.
Jimmy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 08:53 am: Edit Post

I have started using TOOLSTATION.COM for some fixings and fittings, and found their service/prices very good. With most orders being delivered 100% and next day, unlike Screwfix!
With free express delivery why not give them a try?
Regards.
Jimmy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Thursday, January 26, 2006 - 08:39 am: Edit Post

Anyone used the new Yorkshire Tectite Sprint fittings? I did read somewhere that you can get 15mm straights for 10p each, but that may be a 'last leader'.
Thanks.
Jimmy.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris (Chris) on Tuesday, February 28, 2006 - 10:33 am: Edit Post

www.justforcopper.com XL has made it to BES, but not their website yet.
10g (40 joints) 17781 9.12
50g (20 joints) 17782 21.06

If you dig the website for the PRO product you can see a 6min video with rather underwhelming testing, all done at 22C. I would like to know the creep and fatigue behaviour at 120 and 500 psi.

Creep is slow movement under a sustained load which is within the normal elastic range. So does the material spring back or slowly move, so as to relieve the stress. Most joints have some permanent stress on them.

Fatigue is failure after a large number of cycles of elastic movement. It might spring back after each one, but eventually fail for some reason - cracking (more likely in metals) or eg parting from the surface it's stuck to. Most joints would see temperature variations. The thermal expansion would not match copper so there would be stress at every change.

They claim the same elasticity performance as copper. One measure of elastic behavour, Young's modulus, is one of the definitons of "strength". I can't see it being as strong, in that sense, as copper.

Another is the Elastic Limit - how far the material has to be stretched before it no longer returns to its original length. Normally this varies with temperature - no figures given. Solder, it has to be said, is pretty poor at this.

The hammer test... I was thinking af a whack with a 2lb club hammer not that tiny plastic thing. Is it as malleable as solder? In other words how far can you plastically (ie permanently) deform it before it fails?

Most(?) pushfit failures are due to the joint not being assembled properly. How fastidious does one have to be with this material? I believe they quoted a 50% increase in surface area after using 60 grit sandpaper. That sounds rather high, and do they want the same for the inside of the fitting? How much does the 50% figure affect the properties?

I thought about trying a small bottle, but I've gone off the idea. "Going off" would be another question!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jimmy Gillies (Btuguru) on Tuesday, March 28, 2006 - 03:43 pm: Edit Post

Chris,
I did air pressure test on two small pieces of 15mm copper and an EF elbow jointed with this product.

I pressurized it to 6 bar for two weeks and it was fine. I then took my water pump pliers and turned one of the pieces of pipe and it snapped from the fitting instantly.

I'm sticking to solder.


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